Greetings in Jesus name;
First let me apologize for my letter being offensive, or as you
put it , 'such emotion'. I failed to consider a lady might read
it. I spoke with the frankness men sometimes use with each other.
It would be so kind if you would indulge me for the next few
Do I detect a slight sarcasm here - that women are so fragile
that they have to be protected from the 'male' way of expresssion?
Is it commendable for men to be emotional and frank with each
other yet not with members of the opposite gender? I think Yah'shua (Jesus)
spoke with the same grace to all those who were teachable and He
was harsh on all who were not, no matter what gender they had.
All that matters is the position of responsibility and how great
delusion a person is leading others into - not their personal
attributes, be they gender, physical strength or others.
It was interesting to find in reading your letter that the things
I spoke of hit a nerve you may have thought did not exist, or was
completley hid, or covered by a new philosophy of life. The fear
and uncertainty that I decected is so well covered it would be
very difficult to detect, even by a well qualified observer.
You flatter yourself... You are quite mistaken of course - but
you have chosen an efficient weapon by attacking a person's
character because as I am sure you are aware it is difficult to
disprove such a claim, whether it is true or not - all one can
say is 'not true' and the other can say 'yes, it is' and there we
are... So you have chosen to discredit a person by punching under
the belt and going into a personal attack which is not an
honorable way of addressing a subject.
In your refuting my comments made to your husband about an
article he wrote, It was very interesting to say the least, the
way you were parroting anothers views.
You may not be aware of it but all your arguments so far have all
been applied before.. Your argument is not as unique as you may
think. That doesn't mean that you don't believe in them and are a
genuine advocate for them.. Please grant others the same ability
to think rationally as you claim to have yourself.
It was easy to see you were quoating somthing you had read and
even may have much comitted to memory, But!! was not fully in
agrement with deep in your inner self where no one is allowed to
go. In fact you hold many deep secrets, thoughts and hurts you
have covered so completley, only your inner spirit continues to
grieve. This is very serious as this often leads to a sever
The shrink is out of the bag again, making wild guesses, yet
pretending to be authoritative. Your comments are very demeaning
and considering that you know very little about the person you
are adressing you are very bold and very wrong in your
By your writing, I can tell you have very little self esteem, and
a low self confidence problem which go hand in hand. You are not
pleased with what you see looking back at you in the mirror,
especially a full length mirror.
She is a very lovely and pretty person and you don't have a
clue about her self esteem.
You see many changes you would like to make. I see that as a
child you had a better relationship with your mother, which had
the same problem, than with your Father. Your mother taught you a
more submissive, subservant roll, with the desire to please, than
to assert yourself, to be more of a follower than a leader. You
have spent this first part of your life wanting to please others
and wanting others to like you.
I thought Elohim (God) said that we should serve one another - it was
definitely not her mother who did. To be a leader you have to
be able to be a follower. She is perfectly capable of both.
One strong quality you have is the ability to cover up your
feelings so well you deceive your self as well as others. You
really! want to break out of this prison you are in and say to
the world, HEY!! This is who I'am, and I'm good!! You want
to excel and for people to look up to you, you want to accomplish
something in life that will set you apart. You want more of life
than to share a home and children and a man with other women!
And you can!
Having a home, children, a man and sister-wives is a wonderful
part of life. After Yah'shua (Jesus) it is what makes the foundation on
which to build on - don't say that your wife has divorced you and
left your children in order to make a 'life' for herself and that
you have abandoned them all too? What a poor life that would make
- considering that we are created to be living in family units. I
also think that your aproach to our purpose on this earth is
rather secular - Elohim (God) doesn't want us to seek the admiration of
others, all we are to concern ourselves with is to go about His
business. I thought you would know that as a pastor...
And God said, let us make man in our image, after our likness:
and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the
fowl of the air, and over the cattle, and over all the earth, and
over every creeping thing that creepeth upon the earth. 27. So
God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he
him; male and female created he them. 28. And God blessed them,
and God said unto them, Be fruitfull , and multiply, and
replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the
fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every
thing that moveth upon the earth.
I have never had an urge to argue with the Bible.
God wanted to make man in his image and his likeness. First of
all God has all of the attributes of the male and the female
withen himself. So when he created Adam, Eve was also created,
the male and the female in one man Adam. (Gen 5:2) and God
called their name Adam. And see this, He said let them have
dominion over fish, fowl, cattle, And over all the earth. So God
created man in his own image, male and female created he them,
in one man Adam. Repeating again, subue the earth with all that
is in it .
So God formed man out of the dust of the ground, and breathed
into his nostrils the breath of life and man became a living soul.
Both parts of man, his manly nature and his womanly nature
came alive. ( you notice when God made Eve he did not need to
breathe into her nostrils for her to live.)
Your point? Is this supposed to argue against polygamy in some
After a period of time God said it is not good that the man
should be alone, I will bring out of him that which will be a
mate suitable for him.
From here on we see your personal additions and sentiments:
This will make him complete. She has been with him, in him,
but he has not been able to see her, to touch her, or caress
her. He purposely waited for a period of time to bring her forth,
so Adam would feel the lonliness and the vaccuum that would be
completely filled and satisfied when he brought forth that which
had been committed to and in his own body .
When the time was ripe, and Adam's desire was very intense, God
caused a deep sleep to come upon him. While he slept God took
one of his ribs, the womb, and all the womanly attributes, and
made woman, and closed up the flesh thereof. Then God did a
wonderful thing, (who giveth this woman to be married to this
man?) He brought her to the man Adam. I can see Adam as he
gazed upon this the most beautiful of all God's creation, He was
speechless. He wanted to yell to the top of his voice, Wow!
Wow! He thought within his heart, God you have made some
wonderful and lovely things that was breathtaking to say the
least, instantly he recalled looking upon the trees that seemed
to reach the sky and gently moving in the wind painted as with a
painter's brush, with colors never seen with mortal eyes the
sunset of a million evenings. Again he witnessed in his mind the
waters of the Pison, the Ghion, the river Hiddekel, and the
great Euphrates with it's frosty white sprays as it tumbled
toward the mighty ocean. The waters were blue and so crystal
clear you could see the gold shimmering along the sandy bottom,
as well as the bedellium and the onyx stone. He quickly thought
again of the animals that passed before him, each with their
mate, some so regal and royal, some so delicate and tender. He
rembered his own desire for a mate. As he looked upon this woman,
he said God, "surely you have saved the best for last." he
was suddenly brought back to the present as he noticed the
woman's beautiful long hair moving slightly in the breeze. Her
hair looked so soft that surely the clouds must blush in
comparison. He saw she was smiling with a twinkle in her eyes as
if she knew every thought that had just passed through his mind!
Those eyes! looking into her eyes seemed as though you could
see forever, they shine with the reflection of a million sunrises,
yet with the tenderness of the countless stars he had watched
on so many nights. His gaze moved down her body, Oh! her body,
it set ablaze a myriad of passions and desires he had never felt
before. It caused his whole body to tingle, every nerve was on
fire. He could not hide his excitement as he slowly made his way
to her side, as he reache out to take her by the hand. It was
so natural to gently pull her up tightly against him. The
feelings that quickly enveloped his whole body and mind wher
almost more than he could take. He suddenly found his lips
urgently but ever so tenderly touching hers.
I suppose this may have been so - yet more likely not exactly as
your vivid imagination has portrayed it. Again you seem to
believe that you have the capability of reading other people's
minds - what you usually read is your own perception of others.
Even if you by a very long strech would be right about your
enormous assumption, I still don't see your point. If you think
our husband is without emotions for us, and that she is missing
what you describe about Adam or that this will attract her away
from her family, you are sorely mistaken.
The woman's passions was equal or maybe surpassing that of the
man, as ever fiber of her being was kindled for the first time.
In this first embrace she knew she was his and he was hers. She
felt safe, content, and greatly loved. The idea of sharing him
and those wonderful feelings would never never happen because she
was as much a part of him as he was of her. Together they were
one and another would never be needed. As if reading her
thoughts Adam said, you fulfill my every desire. You satisfy my
every need, and I pledge to you and you alone all of my heart
and my love forever more. For you are bone of my bone and flesh
of my flesh, and you shall be called woman because you were
taken out of man .
Again you are adding a great deal to what the Bible says. You
must have a very low opinion of her or women in general to
think that a semi-pornographic epistle of our first parents will
sway her beliefs about Christian polygamy. I have hardly ever
encountered anyone so demeaning to polygamously married women as
you come out by saying in not-too-well-covered-up terms that we
have no brains and are manipulated by emotions only - such an
assumption is gross and ghastly. You also show even more clearly
that you have no clue about what Cristian polygamy actually is -
no wife is deprived of being cherished by her husband. We are all
his completion, each and everyone of us.
Perhaps before you go making further statements based on either
delusion or a vivid imagination it would be wise to actually get
to know what and who you are dealing with as it might save you
from appearing foolish.
You see God did not to breathe the breath of life into Eve like
he did Adam. The breath he breathed into Adam also quickened the
life of the woman which was in him. This is the answer to the
mistry of how two can become one flesh. They were one in the
beginning. God parted them as he took Eve out of his side . He
brought the two together again making one whole . Neither male
nor female is complete without the other.
Agreed. It sound like if you don't believe that she has been
introduced to the mystery of marriage - yet she has told you in
no uncertain terms that she is a married woman.
Both male and female were created on equal ground, neither above
the other. Both were told to have dominion over all the earth (Gensis 1:26)
They were both told to replinish the earth, they
were both told to subdue it.
Just one second. Did you notice who named Eve? Think about it...
God had wonderful plans for the man and the woman as he gave both
the will power and desire to accomplish those plans. He did not
esteem one above the other, but he gave each of them different
job discriptions. The man being larger in frame with big bones
and large muscles he placed as the head. He was to till the
ground, lift heavy loads, and be the protector of the family.
The woman being much smaller and very soft and tender having
great compassion was to give birth and nurture children while
making the home a wonderful place to be.
You have just asked her to step away from that calling in order
to "break out of this prison you are in and say to the world,
HEY!! This is who I'm, and I'm good!! You want to excel
and for people to look up to you, you want to accomplish
something in life that will set you apart. You want more of life
than to share a home and children and a man with other women,
And you can!" - make sure you don't speak with a forked
But in all of these differences she was to have dominion with her
husband. God called them both Adam. (Gen. 5:2)
When Eve was in Adam - he had the dominion over his body - when
she was taken out she became an entity called Eve by Adam. She
was part of him and when they were in agrement she ruled with him
as they were still one in mind and intent. She was never meant to
divert from the Lord's will neither Adam's as their wills were all
After Adam and Eve had sinned by disobeying God's word they
immediately died spiritually. Fellowship with God was broken
they could no longer walk with him. Every good thing comes from
God, So having lost fellowship with God they lost all of the
godly attributes of God. The word tells us that God is love, so
without God we do not know what love is, All the good went from
man, and all the bad came in. Jesus said of the sinners of his
day, "Ye are of your father the devil and the works of your
father will you do.
It was because of sin, and after the fall that God said to the
woman, "In sorrow shall you bring forth children, and your
desire shall be unto thy husband and he shall rule over you".
This was not said to her while there was no sin in her life,
only afterward. So when restoration and reconciliation came
through Jesus Christ, the curse was removed from the woman as
from man. Sin was delt with, and power to bring the ungodly
appetites of the flesh under control, even polygyany.
Except from your adding the last two words I agree - you say that
polygamy is the lust of the flesh - what a great error. I don't
think you really mean that people shouldn't marry anymore because
it involves sex? Sex or marriage itself is not a sin - it is
ungodly lust that ruins people.
Jealously came very quickly with the fall, anger and murder
followed. Heartache, cheating, sickness, wars, worship of false
gods, and sexual sins. All sins did not come at once, they came
slowley as man moved futher away from the rememberance of a time
when men walked with God. Multiple wives came after a long peorid
of time. The seventh from Adam in the line of Cain, a man name
Lamech was the first. (Gen.4:19). Wives became nothing more than
slaves in the home, to be sold traded or kicked out at the will
of her husband. This was not the plan of God in the beginning.
Man no longer had the love of God in his heart, and not being
able to control the lust for sexual relationships with women, He
began to take wives, concubines, handmadens, virgins, and even
animals, and finaly other men.
Although you say some truths you mix it with wrong assumptions
here. Adam and Eve never got married - does that mean that
marriage is wrong? If marriage came to pass at a time after the
fall does that make it wrong? Marrying one or more women has
never been faulted by Yahweh - He has however spoken up against
carnal lusts, being with animals, siblings other men and taking
other men's wife/wives, but marriage has never been banned and
you are in danger of calling white black here - be warned.
This is why God allowed moses to make laws to control humanity's
relationship with humanity.
Moses didn't make the laws - Yahweh did.
To keep as much pease and justice as possable in a world where
sin could not be delt without the sheding of innocent blood, his
Son Jesus Christ. God's hands were tied by his own righteousness,
You are trying to indicate that God was careful not to address
what was right and wrong, because the people couldn't live it -
that is completely wrong - do you think He cared so little for
the women as to not protect them in His law? God stated very
clearly what was right and what was wrong, in fact we are being
showed more grace when we repent in the New Covenant than in the
Old. Don't go twisting scripture to fit your own personal agenda.
sin could only be pushed ahead year by year, but allowed to
continue. So God did not create man to be a polygymist, nor did
he condone it,
As a matter of fact He did - He wanted to give David more wives
if he had wanted it. I belive that was because David was a
godly man and thus a blessing to his wives.
He could only control sin by laws till Jesus the Mesiah came.
Then why isn't there a law against polygamy? In fact there is a
law concerning how to live it - there is no such law on living
homosexually as homosexuality is illegal in the first place.
After Messiah, rules to regulate sin was done away with, and power
to remove them and to live above them came into being, PRAISE
Chapter and verse please... In fact Paul said that he had a thorn
in his side that made him do what he hated - we are not perfect
yet or else you would not have misjudged her so badly and
wouldn't have such a flawed view of our marriage, but praise Yahweh
He has now shown us the way to be perfected and sanctified
through Yah'shua (Jesus) - yet like the clay we have to be willing to be
formed by His hands (even when it is painful and long cherished
beliefs) in order to become a beautiful and useful vase to His
Now every man is to have his own wife, and every woman is to have
her own husband, and to bring into subjection every sin by the
power of the new birth. (Eph.4:17 to 24).
I have my own husband and I wouldn't swap him for anyone because
I have been made his and he mine in Yahweh, thus my husband has
me and I have him and I have no intention of breaking my covenant
to him and I know that he won't break his to me. In the same
manner Yah'shua (Jesus) is my own Saviour and I am his own allegorical bride
- that doesn't stop you from being the same and having Him as
your own Saviour - does it?
This I say therefore and testify in the Lord, that ye henceforth
walk not as other gentiles walk, in the vanity of their mind,
having their understanding darkened, alienated from the life of
God through ignorance that is in them, because of the blindness
of their hearts. Who being past feeling hath given themselves
unto lasciviousness, to work all uncleanliness with greediness.
But!! ye have not so learned Christ; if so be that ye have
heard him , and have been taught by him as the truth is in Jesus.
That ye put off concerning the former conversations (life
style) the old man, which is corrupt according to the deceitful
lust. And that ye put on the new man which after God is created
in righteousness and true holiness .
Amen - I can't see any rightous purpose of quoting this scripture
at her though. It seems like if you are trying to indicate that
her marriage is based on corruption and deceitful lust, but I
strongly advice you to think again. Be sure to judge righteous
judgement and I can catagorically state that in this instance
your judgement is poor to say the least and evil at its utter
What about the law? The law is superceeded by faith Gal.3:19 to
25. Wherefore then serveth the law? It was added because of
transgressions, till the seed should come to whom the promise was
made. And it was ordained by angels in the hand of a mediator.
Now a mediator is not a mediator of one, But God is one.
Please make your mind up - is there a law that has to be followed
or not - if not then nothing is wrong or sinful; if 'yes' let's
operate from what Yahweh has to say and not what we think He
Christ is the mediator of the new covenant. Is the law against
the promises of God? God forbid; for if there had been a law
given which could have given life, (done away with sin) verily
righteousness should have been by the law. But !! the scripture
hath concluded all under sin, that the promise by faith of Jesus
Christ might be given to them that believe. But before faith
came, we were kept under the law, shut up unto the faith which
afterwards be revealed. Wherefore the law was our school master;
to bring us unto Christ, that we might be justifyied by faith.
(faith liberates from law) But after that faith is come, we are
no longer under a school master!!! For you are all the
children of God by faith in Christ Jesus. For as many of you as
have been baptised into Christ have put on Christ. There is
neither Jew nor Greek, there is neither bond nor free, there is
neither male nor female; for you are all in Christ Jesus. And
if ye be in Christ then are ye Abraham's seed and heirs according
to the promise.
Funny that the heirs of the promise stem from a polygamist...
(Read II Corinthians 3:1 through 17) All through the new
testament, adultery, infidelity, fornication, lust,
lasciviness, fleshly appetites, etc
Again you are defining white as black and condemning people of
sins they do not have the remotest intent of or are commiting. It
is in the same category as if I accused you of being a homosexual
at heart - Please don't judge when your sight is muddled it won't
benefit anyone and bring damage to yourself and whoever swallows
. . Rules for husbands and wives were given.
Paul was teaching in the seventh chapter of I Corinthians of such
things. Nevertheless to avoid fornication (adultery) let every
man have his own wife, and let every woman have her own husband
This is the seccond time you have mentioned that one reference..
Now please do not bring up your unlearned giberish about those
words meaning singular in one instance and plural in another;
Paul was a scholar of his day having been instructed at the feet
of Gamel [sic], and became a member of the Sanhedrin, and taught
according to the perfect manor of the law of the fathers. He was
not ignorant of jewish religion, he had the best instructor in
the jewish world. (Acts 22:5) To be a member of the Sanhedrin
you must be able to quote the levitical law from memory. Paul
would not be so foolish to take up precious time and make a fool
of himself by saying let every man have his own wife, and every
woman have her own husband, if polygyny were accepted by God ,
Paul wasn't refering to polygamy at all. He was saying don't be
whores and whoremongers - stick to your own - don't go lusting
after other people's mates. He was right.
when if that were the case it would make no difference how long
they abstained from sex by consent, he would not have to give
that command to come together as soon as possible to avoid
fornication, because there would be several other wives standing
in line waiting her turn .
You fail to take into consideration that when a man consents to
abstain - he abstains no matter how many wives he has.
How ridiculious can you get? Polygymy is of satan, as part of
his great hatred for God and his desire to destroy the family
Be careful here - you have set out to destroy our family, if that
God ordained leaving father and mother and cleaving to one wife
and becoming one flesh. A husband and wife has secrets between
themselves they share with no one else. Weeknesses, fears,
hopes, plans, dreams, and intimacy. If another woman
(wife ) comes into the family there are those same intimacy
between these two that cannot be shared. So the house (home)
becomes divided, the more wives the more divisions.
You talk as though you think you know what polygamous marriage is
- but you are proving that you don't - I don't feel called upon
to have you study my private life but I will say that this
family is strongly united and that polygamy has only added to
that unity - not ever divided it!
Jesus said a house divided against itself cannot stand.
Well here is your proof - ours is standing and will continue to do so.
When a man takes a second wife it is a sin. He steals another
man's half that is meant to make him complete .
In that case God was helping David to steal wives.
Children that were meant to be born of that man and woman who
cannot now complete one another will never be born. Therefore
polygymy becomes a crying sin like murder. God said in Gensis to
Cain the cry of thy brother's blood comes to me from the ground.
Murder is a crying sin because one life isn't all that is taken.
The children and grand children are also murdered. His lintage
all through generations are murdered .
Your reasoning is based on a false assumption and therefore not
valid - actually you are the one who is denying my husband his
children by the wives Yahweh has given him, and thus you are
trying to not let his offspring get into existence, so who's
Homosexuality is a crying sin. God said to Abraham, the cry of
Sodom has come up before me.
Indeed - why didn't Yahweh use that opportunity to chastise
Abraham for living polygamously?
As with polygymy and murder homosexuality destroys children,
grand children and the lintage forever, murdering the innocent.
They cannot produce offsprings. God said be fruitful, multiply
and replenish the earth.
Polygamists heed that commandment - homosexuals don't, God
hates homosexuality. God said that he was married to Israel and
Judah - He has never claimed to be married to a man - God forbid,
because Yahweh hates sin, and protects polygamy.
Respectfully (Pastor T) the true watchman
I hope you will be able to take off those distorted glasses that
are tainted by the wordly culture that hates godly marriage, be
it monogamous or polygamous. I believe you agree that this world
has nothing but contempt for the teachings of our Elohim (God) when it
comes to what exactly we people should be doing here as greed and
selfishness is dominant and people follow whatever itches their
ears. So please try to see past what we have been taught by such
people and really open up to what the Bible actually teaches
without having to add a lot of your own intents into it, then we
will be able to unite in the Holy Sprit and not go defending
unrighteous pet doctrines like God only allowing men to have one